Madeleine McCann: Watching The Parents
MORE no news on the Madeleine McCann case.
It is now a week since the three-year-old girl was snatched from a Portugal holiday resort.
The story has been distressing to watch on our TV screens. What it must like for the parents of Madeleine only a few can know.
BLAME
But their misery is far from complete. With no news of Madeleine, and the Portuguese police having no need to indulge the British tabloids with speculation and theory, Madeleine’s parents are the central characters.
And today’s front-page news, as reported by the caring Mirror, is: “THEY KNOW LEAVING KIDS WAS WRONG.”
Does the Mirror mean to say that Madeleine’s parents, Kate and Gerry, now think they did the wrong thing in nipping out for a bite to eat and leaving the children in the apartment on what they thought was a secure resort?
Does the Mirror mean that the McCanns know that popping back regularly to look at their children and checking on their well being was less than perfect?
Does the Mirror mean that the McCanns realise they should not have left their children alone, just like it is wrong to leave a child in a hotel under the auspices of a baby monitoring service, to leave a child in the car while mum goes to pay for petrol, to talk to a neighbour over a garden fence while the children are indoors?
Of course this is not the Mirror’s view. Oh, no. This is Madeleine’s grandmother, Susan Healy, saying: “They know this was a mistake. But it wasn’t child neglect, it wasn’t not caring for your children.”
That she feels the need to say this is wrong. That the Mirror can lead with Madeleine’s grief-worn parents is pathetic and misguided. That the paper can talk of “people are asking why they didn’t make use of the crèche” at the resort or take the children out to dinner with them is wrong.
But the Mirror has news to write. And the police aren’t playing the game.
THEORIES
So the Mirror produces: “THE 6 THEORIES.”
Only six! Why this cautious approach? But it is all the Mirror has. And readers hear of the “PAEDOPHILE GANG”, the “LONE PAEDOPHILE”, the “JEALOUS MOTHER”, Madeleine wandering off and “DROWNED”, the “OPPORTUNIST PAEDOPHILE”, the “CHILDLESS COUPLE”.
But the Sun has more. It has 130 more. As the front-page headline screams: “MADDIE COPS HUNT 130 BRIT PAEDOS.”
The paper says “at least” 130 British paedophiles “might” have taken Madeleine McCann.
In “ALGARVE IS ‘HAVEN’ FOR PERVS”, readers learn that Portugal is a “magnet for sun-seeking perverts from Britain and the rest of Europe”.
Who knew that perverts get off on watching children at the beach?
Us And Them
But help is on its way. The Sun lists the British coppers who will go out there and see to it that justice is done. We, says the paper, are the only country with a sex offenders’ register.
All convicted perverts must inform the police of their desire to go abroad. At least 130 have. And the police are looking for them.
But – and whisper this – might it be that convicted sexual deviants don’t all tell the police what they plan to do? They are not monitored while overseas. And might it be that not all sexual predators are caught and make it to the list?
Among the policemans’ names is Detective Superintendent Graham Hill, attached to theChild Exploitation and Protection Centre. Hill is on the case. He has flown to Portugal.
Hill worked on the case of Milly Dowler. She was snatched from near Walton railway station, Surrey, in 2002. Her body was found six months later. Her killer or killers have never been caught.
Perhaps Hill’s experiences can help. Perhaps he’ll have more luck. Perhaps not.
Meanwhile, a family is distraught, and bearing up incredibly well under the strain and the merciless gaze of the newspapers…
Posted: 10th, May 2007 | In: Madeleine McCann Comments (2,260) | Follow the Comments on our RSS feed: RSS 2.0 | TrackBack | Permalink
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September 14th, 2007 at 4:16 pm
a person…
I dont want to believe that the Mccanns have anything to do with Maddie’s disappearance. I dont like the one fact we have and that is they left their small children alone night after night in an unlocked apartment, in a strange country while they had a good time with their friends. The Mccanns didnt seem to think this was wrong at the time. Since they did this more than once, I think the Mccanns are quilty of being selfish. Putting their good time BEFORE their children. I dont know them so I cant judge, I can only state my opinion. Like i said we dont have any facts that we can confirm as true at this time, we can only go by what we read. If anything I have read in the last few days is true, then it looks like the Mccanns had something to do with it. I will just have to wait along with everyone else to see what happens. I cant believe that 2 countries and all the press would want to smear them. One thing I know is Maddie is still missing. Something is very wrong with this case.
September 14th, 2007 at 4:09 pm
Andrew, some interesting and valid points. There are some contributors to various forums who seem blind and unwilling to accept the possibility that the McCanns are responsible for the death or disappearance of Madeleine, even in the face of some disturbing comments made by the Portuguese police.
I will admit to some reluctance to believing them guilty, if only because the thought that a parent could be responsible for their child’s death and then seek to cover up the fact is a terrible one. I try to be dispassionate about it and must say that much of what we read in the media indicates their guilt.
I am under the impression that the fund directors can and will block any attempt by the McCanns to use the Find Madeleine fund to pay for legal fees in defending themselves against any criminal charges. I know that some of those directors are family or friends, but there are others who are not bound by such loyalties are there not? Maybe I’m wrong. It certainly would be better if none of the directors had family, social or work ties to the McCanns, that would certainly avoid any accustions of impropriety.
September 14th, 2007 at 3:57 pm
Hi, I am following the board for some days now and the case from the beginning.
Sorry for my bad english, I am german. I just read in the german news that sniffer dogs found blood in an appartment not far from the Mccanns appartment and the police would think that Madeleine (or the corpse?) would have been “stored” there for a while.
Is there any confirmation on this piece of informantion?
The german press is quite nutral, and they point out that the couple is as strong as in the first days.
Following the german press I don´t really know what to believe.
What a strange case.
September 14th, 2007 at 3:55 pm
When you can show me proof Andrew and not just media hype then maybe I would be able to make the decision but as for now I do not believe the crap that they are giving out because they contradict themselves too many times.
Lies and smears are what I have seen and from going on the other case to do with Joanna the PJs involved are supposedly being questioned for falsifying evidence.
So I have no faith in the Portuguese PJs and the Media being the UK or the Portuguese Media seem to be giving or leaking claims that they really no is not true but it sells papers so what the hell.
When the Evidence is deemed as credible then I will be able to say I was wrong or I was right which ever.
But Andrew if you believe everything that you hear from the Media then you are very naive.
What Bona fida cause did the IRA have? They were terrorist there was no cause other than to kill innocent people and then claimed they were in a war what a joke.
September 14th, 2007 at 3:26 pm
I see there are still ‘Team McCann’ lovers in here. Why not simply look at the facts instead of what you want to believe? From what I see, a lot of people simply don’t want to believe a white middle class professional couple could be capable of having involvement in this type of crime, irrespective of any actual evidence, whether it be proven scientific, or merely circumstantial.
Of course it’s all a “smear” The whole World really wants to believe parents could do this type of thing. GET A GRIP!! Nobody wants that, only team McCann lovers say that sort of smear thing.
The British and Portugese Police have got better motivations than to involve themselves in covering up a serious crime like this. If they wanted to cover anything up it would be easier to say “We haven’t got a clue” and leave the case open. To allege that they would want to pin a crime on allegedly “grieving” parents is sicker than the events of Madeleine’s alleged abduction. (Disappearance)
Notice my choice of word, it’s not a McCann creation. She’s disappeared. There’s no evidence of any abduction. There is however mounting evidence of a drugged corpse in the boot of their car… alongside all the other mounting inconsistancy. To anyone with a rational open mind it’s not looking good.
How many guilty people say “It’s a fit up, it wasn’t me guvvnor” You ask any Police officer, the answer will be “Nearly all of them”
As for using the “fund” to defend the McCanns, I think you will find that they can use it and probably will to some extent. There’s nothing to stop them other than public outrage and the resulting lack of support. They can in theory be paid out of the fund for “expenses” or what-have-you, and just spend it on anything they like. That’s the only reason they arent using the fund. Yes the fund they set up within a week or two. Handy! Is this the same fund they haven’t actually really used for looking for Madeleine? Yes, that’s the one.
This whole saga is about mind control. The sad facts are that some people are PAID to come into forums and spout Pro-MaCann trivia, and some even less informed “average” pundits just can’t accept facts and make “heartfelt” blurbs for free, which are really doing nothing but pretending reality doesn’t exist.
Seperate your heart from your mind and I’m afraid Team McCann is quite possibly very guilty. I feel that you McCann supporters out there have at best been fooled, and at worst corrupted your free thinking capability to the point where “I support Criminals” You should see some of the posts on “the times online” some of the people there are pure TeamMcCann
“I would love to contribute to their defend fund, it’s wonderful” type of thing.
One is even a professor from great ormond street hospital allegedly. The mind boggles.
I would rather support the I.R.A than the McCanns, at least they have a bona fide cause
September 14th, 2007 at 3:15 pm
Gossip & tat : I’m sorry if you find my posts hard to read. I have done my best to ensure correct spelling, grammar and constructed the sentences as best as I can to get my point across clearly. I have also tried to use paragraphs to seperate the differing points. I don’t claim to be perfect but I’m doing my best.
In this spirit, may I suggest you look at your own posts in the same way before posting. Also, it would make them more readable and interesting if you refrained from using foul language and hurling insults at other contributors, such as Sandra. I’m sure you have many worthwhile contributions to make, as have others, and I look forward to reading them in due course.
Regarding the content of your post 1610 : I too have searched for reports regarding porn on Murat’s and Malinka’s computers as well as any previous criminal offences for either of them. I found plenty of references to the allegations and a number which state they are unconfirmed but none which confirm these allegations.
September 14th, 2007 at 2:28 pm
I’ would more say that i read the police does not let information come out or if it does it is most certainly the opposit of they are doing in the moment. It is said this is a common method in portuguese police so they can work away from all the buzz.and the neewspapers and tvs go along and make storys, i will not surprise if the result will br totally diferent after and we will be astonished and prob have to admit they are good. they ow nothing to anyone,they ar not obliged to speak about the findings and in if fact it is against their law i guess.
September 14th, 2007 at 2:22 pm
Star everything that is being told about the evidence is hear say nothing that has been said can be proved as the case is not finnished they cannot say that it was blood hair or if she was overdosed as they are not allowed to give out this information.
In the article you are speaking about at the bottom British DNA specialists state that the amount of DNA was not sufficient to get a trace of sleeping pills.
I am wondering why so many leaks are happeneing and why people tend to believe them surely by now people are seeing it is just one big smear campaign.
When and if the truth comes out i hope who ever is involved gets what they deserve.
One thing Star what do you believe are you confussed i am but i have noticed that you keep jumping from defence to against? but forget all of that do you in your heart believe that the McCanns have done what they are saying.
September 14th, 2007 at 1:52 pm
Now the DNA samples say Maddie died of a sleeping pill overdose. I can hear the Mccanns now…Well now, how did she get a hold of those?
Like i said before, the longer this goes on the more the Mccanns look quilty…quilty of something…If they are indeed innocent…why would someone do this to them..God Help Them!!
September 14th, 2007 at 1:40 pm
I have 6 great kids they are all very hard work aswel.l but i love them dearly, but if you was to read some of the things that i have put into my diary on certain days when my kids have played up you would think from what i have wrote that i hated them.
A diary is somewhere to go and vent, look into any diary of a teenager and your see at least once a week them write that they hate thier mum and dad, they hate thier best friends, because your diary dosnt tell you that you shouldnt say these things or that your being nasty it just lets you vent.
Then after you have wrote all of this you can then calm down and go back to being the loving parent or daughter or son.
A diary wouldnt tell the true feelings of anyone.
As for all these reports that she was cold towards her children where did these come from? The locals when Madeleine went missing always said how happy a family they looked.
The truth to this is noone knows and the police are getting to the point where they will try anything.
September 14th, 2007 at 1:32 pm
Who knows if this really is in the diary…..
Meanwhile, it was reported that Kate McCann’s private diary documents her struggles to look after her “hysterical” children and reveals details about the night Madeleine went missing.
I also doubt that she would of wrote down anything to incriminate herself.
To me is sounds like they wanted to party on Holiday, and the kids were an inconvenience. That is why from day one i have wondered why they took 3 small kids on Holiday. It sounds like the rest in their party didnt have a problem with leaving kids alone, one was sick and vomiting and still left.
September 14th, 2007 at 1:27 pm
Oh yes the Pope…..we read that the Mccanns had to buy new clothes to go see the Pope. ( I dont think the Pope cares what you wear.) And they complained about the heat until SOMEONE had to get them an umbrella and water.
Gerry complained about the second apartment they mored into…that is was smaller and not as nice.
Kate complained about wearing a t-shirt with Maddie’s pic on it…something about the other people on Holiday dont want to be reminded of a small girl being taken.
Now they are complaining about everyone making this into a smear campaign, the police, the press.
Kate complains about her kids in her diary(if this is true) how Gerry doesnt help her…
September 14th, 2007 at 1:22 pm
I know this is not about Madeleine but it was posted on here that only boys were affected by the childrens homes but here it says
Staff at the network of 10 children’s homes, which currently has 4,600 children in its care, have said they believe more than 100 boys and girls currently with them may have been abused.
These are children without parents who put thier trust in people that were looking after them and were abused some were disabled children so i have read, to say you dont know who too believe is so sad.
September 14th, 2007 at 1:20 pm
Some people seem to think the Mccanns have been framed. I was just wondering WHY someone would take Madeleine and then go to all the trouble of planting DNA samples in the parents rented car and in the apartment.
This last bit of info on drugs being found in the samples just makes Mom and Dad look MORE guilty. Of course the Mccanns will deny it all.(we heard that Maddie was a sleepwalker…so this makes drugging her ok? what about the twins? they didnt wake up with people yelling and running all over and being picked up? I will really be shocked if the person responsible for Maddie’s disappearance is found and it is someone other than her parents.
Also the cuddle cat thing, again….if someone took her they would not be concerned with a toy. If it was in her hands it might of been taken along or dropped to the floor, but why would this person take the time to pick it up and place it where it was found. Also kate washing it? Why? I read it was dirty and had sun tan lotion on it. If it was the last thing Maddie touched, you wouldn’t want to remove your child’s scent…If the Mccanns are innocent, they definately are an odd couple.
September 14th, 2007 at 1:10 pm
I’ve an idea for the team mccann haters, what about a theory that they had nothign to do with her disappearance, but others did? Cos’ you can see when they go to meet the pope it is the only time they are dressed in black and black is the catholic ceremony colour for funerals. they did go on a private jet did not pass customs, how about them two doing madeleine funeral in theyr mind, bless the photo, meawhile some friends we hidding the body because the hired car has far more km than that they could have done when they’re using it.the km registered at the car rental proves that the car went many many km, maybe to spain that is near. the mccanns could not do those km himselfs they were always followed everywhere and while they went on the travels someone hide teh body. when they meet the pope they already feel she is dead, no hope anymore, otherway woould choose a color of hope
September 14th, 2007 at 1:07 pm
amazed - as if i kept the bloody sites. if yer are a grown up type in ‘porn found on murats computer’ and there is plenty for you to choose from - same re malinka
dont be so bloody lazy. ive spent hundreds of hours since may looking for some way to find the truth.
and yer wrong about the police not looking, too. they are. only its a secret.
September 14th, 2007 at 1:00 pm
This is what i read about the Joana case today part of it i have cut and pasted the part that makes me think about how this could be connected to Madeleine and why this hasnt been looked into.
(Joana’s mother and uncle were jailed for her murder, but five police officers have now been accused of forcing false confessions out of them.
Mr Williams-Thomas believes that because of the huge doubts over the convictions, whoever abducted Joana is more than likely to be behind Madeleine’s disappearance.
Joana vanished in Figueira He said he could not understand why the police are pursuing their “ludicrous” investigation into the McCanns, when such a strong line of inquiry remains open.
He added: “There’s not a single case in the UK where two children who are unknown to each other have been abducted or disappeared within a period of four years in a seven-mile radius.
“On that basis it has to be a serious line of inquiry to eliminate it as a huge coincidence.)
This is too much of a coincidence to not look into but they have who they believed killed Joana even though they dont have a body so why look!
Feeding a body to pigs would not have got rid of all evidence also with enough time and questioning and other methods you can get anyone to say anything, if the mother had bruises then maybe she is another innocent victim who just fell into the too hard basket to be solved.
September 14th, 2007 at 11:55 am
“I read much the same about the porn and bestiality on Murats site and Malinkas on many sites. a few of the german sites talk about Malinkas sex offences.”
Please don’t spare us, Gossip & Tat, - we’re grown-ups, allegedly - so just give us the links which ‘verify’ this libel so that we can exonerate the parents, congratulate the reporter who said Mr. Murat was ‘weird’, and just generally put this perplexing case to bed. Goodness. I suppose the truth must be out there somewhere … unless she really was abducted by a total stranger. Unlikely, I admit, but possibly true, and nobody seems to be looking at it now.
And if I’d kept a diary of my experiences with two children under 3 all those years ago, I think it would have been fairly damning. Never mind three exuberant children under 4, with a father who apparently didn’t pull his weight (I know all about that).
I do think possibly Gerry controls Kate. Still doesn’t mean they did it, though.
September 14th, 2007 at 11:36 am
oh me gosh
September 14th, 2007 at 11:35 am
oh my Gosh why do u people only believe wot u see if u think carefully u can see the portugese police r just trying to pin it on the mcanns. I dont know why u all compare this case up to other cases. This is about MADDIE and no1 know for sure what happened. Sandra u speak pretty good english to me i think u r either american or english or irish or welsh got to be. All i do know is that the context u r using is shit u speak about things that aint even to do with madeliene get a grip. I think if anything that one of their m8s may have harmed maddie why havent they been inteviewed yet?and i think Gerry has kept himself more calm and collected more so than kate but still that doesnt mean its him or her. I dont know what grounds that have to charge them i really dont all that DNA crap it dont mean anything at all. Dont you think the mcanns r going through enough with losing their child and then have to get put through this and they ave said even tho this is happening they will not stop looking for maddie. They need as much support as they can get right now. U people r slagging the Mcanns of meanwhile this girl has really been ubducted its not fair. You people are heartless and I cannot believe my eyes.
September 14th, 2007 at 11:34 am
why do u people only believe wot u see if u think carefully u can see the portugese police r just trying to pin it on the mcanns. I dont know why u all compare this case up to other cases. This is about MADDIE and no1 know for sure what happened. Sandra u speak pretty good english to me i think u r either american or english or irish or welsh got to be. All i do know is that the context u r using is shit u speak about things that aint even to do with madeliene get a grip. I think if anything that one of their m8s may have harmed maddie why havent they been inteviewed yet?and i think Gerry has kept himself more calm and collected more so than kate but still that doesnt mean its him or her. I dont know what grounds that have to charge them i really dont all that DNA crap it dont mean anything at all. Dont you think the mcanns r going through enough with losing their child and then have to get put through this and they ave said even tho this is happening they will not stop looking for maddie. They need as much support as they can get right now. U people r slagging the Mcanns of meanwhile this girl has really been ubducted its not fair. You people are heartless and I cannot believe my eyes.
September 14th, 2007 at 11:14 am
powder monkey if you want people to actually read your posts put breaks in them.
sandra’s theory of injecting a corpse with saline is absolutely laughable.
I read much the same about the porn and bestiality on Murats site and Malinkas on many sites. a few of the german sites talk about Malinkas sex offences.
September 14th, 2007 at 11:01 am
A Person: GRAPHIC CONTENT IN THE NEXT WORDS - I remember Joana case, it was awfull and shocking, still is. Her mother and uncle confessed they hit her and she collided with a head to a wall and died. Then the cut her in pieces and gave her for the pigs to eat, and I am terribly sorry for the graphic content. After the confession she claimed she was tortured by the police and appears in photos with her face all black. One thing I never understood is why the police tortured her in the face, it is known by historical records from privious centuries that there are forms of torture that leave no marks, if she was tortured the police was really brutal and stupid above all.
About Madeleine fund the Mccanns are right, they will not use the fund for their defense, they are thinking in rasing a new separate fund. So that Madeleine fund goes on searching for her and the people all around the world can continuing donating and start donating to the new fund.
And finally, you are right, the persons that have and know the real evidence are not allowed to speak. So, everything being published until now are claimed as leaks from de police or are just inventions that most of the media must use to go on selling. Like a guessing game… We know for the experience that police does not “leak”, and generally in the end it all comes out like a bomb.
September 14th, 2007 at 10:43 am
Gossip and tat: about the surname “Pollard”, it is very natural that I don’t know which Pollard you refer since English is not my first language and I do not live in UK. Still I can manage very well understanding foreign languages and that gives me some kind of “advantage” if I can call it that, I am not superior to anyone else, but this allows me to see things more clear as I can access the press and TV which are presented in portuguese, french, spanish, english, german and italian. SO that gives me a much wider view than someone who only reads english. I innocently answered my surname because it is the truth I have no reason not to saw, it’s just my surname.
expat: Concerning the case of Casa Pia, when I referred boys is for you to understand that the issue is a little diferent than just having some VIPs involved in the case and sometimes not totally explained. Some people may think it is about abusing all children, while this case is only about boys who were in a orphanate. It is alleged they were abused and suffered very much at the hands of some VIP persons, including polititians, tv persons, lawers and doctors. It was an awfull case and people don’t know who to believe, because some victims have allegedly claimed they have been paid to make the accusations to certain personalities to spoil their reputation, and as this envolves politics I guess we will never find out the real truth. What I only know is that most certainly fot sure some of those poor boys were abused, but because someone instilled the doubt the case is going on for years.
As for me referring “damn the day they put….” it is a kind of relief I make just like the Mccanns did, when they referred how unlucky they were to have choosen this location for their holidays. And that day is “damn” because it was the start of the way for Madeleine to disappear. Then I read in a TV forum, all kinds of persons saying also, “damn that country, I’ll never put my feet there and their country will go down withour tourism”…well, something awfull happened to poor Madeleine and it seems that it is Portugal’s fault. And for someone thinking Portugal lives only from tourism reveals a lot of ignorance. But I make it clear, it was not in this posts, it was in Sky news forum.
When I referred I was rich, yes I am, but it all came from my family hard work for more than 40 years and now the business has passed to me, and this was to refer that because I am rich I can spend the time in a different way other people cannot and I can also travel a lot, meaning I am not confined to my little corner. By travelling I can contact many different people and cultures and have my eyes a little more opened than someone who does not, but that is obvious.
As for this all issue of the little Madeleine, which everyone seems to be forgetting, I said long before that in my heart I consider the parents guilty, if not of the crime of her alleged death, they are guilty of her disappearance because THEY LEFT THEIR CHILDREN ALONE! That what hurts the most and tells much of this kind of parenting. Such a loving and caring family as they and friends claim they are, would never live their children alone, door opened, foreign country….NIGHT AFTER NIGHT! And this is not speculation, it is a fact, it is confirmed by the Ocean Club records and witnesses (who are british) and the Mccanns confirmed it was true. So I cannot consider them innocent in this issue, as for the rest of the accusations only time will tell.
I’ll be going to Tunisia tomorrow for some holidays, I hope when I get back there will be other news, I hope positive ones, leading to find little Madeleine, which is the only thing that matters. Dont worry, I will not take my laptop, so I wont be bothering you for some time. It will be a 8 day circuit, so it is no good hanging around with too much things to carry.
Meanwhile keep your dialogue in the pursuit of trying to understand this sad story, remember above all that freedom of speach is a right and discussions are natural. For good or for worse the truth will come up some day.
BE WELL AND THE BEST TO EACH AND ALL OF YOU
September 14th, 2007 at 10:30 am
Re the fund, it has been reported today that the main reason that it just sits there without seeming to do anything proactive to find Madeleine is that very early on the McCanns were told by the PJ that it is illegal for anyone to investigate a crime on which the police are active - so no private eyes.
Forums are also in the news, raising the possibility that some here may find themselves quoted ….
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/europe/article2449020.ece
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/columnists/ben_macintyre/article2448861.ece
I must say I deplore these comments about Sandra who, whatever her stance on this, basically comes across as a thoughtful and useful poster - her big mistake was to say she was rich! Not realising, perhaps, that this gets certain Brits going more than almost anything else. I’m not rich at all, but I don’t have a problem with other people being so, especially if it’s a result of hard work and initiative. Like the poor, they will always be with us. And did I detect a suggestion that she might be someone rather more interesting than she claims? Seems unlikely since she alerted us to the activities of organisations like Editorial Intelligence.
The McCanns do seem quite well-connected with powerful people in the media, politics etc. (many of whom will be backing away like mad now). But have you ever played the 6 Degrees of Association game? If you have, you won’t be surprised.
September 14th, 2007 at 9:55 am
I mentioned a case on here yesterday that I had read about and today it is in the news about how close the Madeleine case and the Joana case are they are similar and Joana still has not been found.
They want the PJs to stop the case against Gerry and Kate and go back to looking at this case.
Joana Cipriano vanished from a village just seven miles from Praia da Luz, where Madeleine disappeared in 2004. This has never been mentioned until now why is this from what I was lead to believe this was such a shock to the village nothing like this had ever happened to them, maybe not them but 7 miles is not that far away. I believe that Madeleine was taken I don’t believe although the McCann’s are intelligent for one minute they were able to do all of this without leaving one bit of evidence incriminating them that was easily found that night. The evidence found now is clearly speculation now so many rumours and no solid proof. The only people that know what evidence there really is are not allowed to speak.
With all of these leaked rumours (which I must say half have been proved to be lies) the McCann will never get a fair go the world has been convinced they are guilty before it has been proved. Joana Cipriano mother still insists she was innocent but they still charged her.
Some of the big names giving all the big donations to the fund have pulled out because of this media hanging of the McCann’s, so just because they get called suspects it doesn’t matter about finding Madeleine or the other missing children lets just stop people donating by slandering everyone involved.
As its been proved the McCann’s cannot tuck into the fund, so your little ideas of such a great scam were completely wrong!
September 14th, 2007 at 9:49 am
Press reports today are focusing on the toxicology results from body fluids supposedly showing that drugs were present. They also state that these body fluids are Madeleine’s - I wasn’t aware that these had been postively identified as hers. Toxicology tests on hair samples are ongiong and it will be some weeks before the results are known. If you want an authoritive opinion on the evidential value of DNA traces, then Sir Alec Jeffrey is your man - he developed genetic fingerprinting in the 1970’s. The first mass screening in the UK was the Colin Pitchfork case in Leicestershire, of all places!
If any of the trace evidence from the car is identified as belonging to Madeleine the McCanns will have some very awkward questions to answer.
I am interested in the legal status of arguido. It has been widely reported that until someone is given this status there are certain questions that the Portuguese police cannot ask. Are any of the contributors to this discussion able to enlighten me as to what those questions are? In the U.K., when you are formally or informally interviewed by the police then any question may be put to you and it would be the answers that would make you a suspect or not. It has also been well reported that both parents refused to answer a number of questions. Whilst it would be very interesting to know what questions, the fact that they refused to answer could be damning in a court of law, apart from the obvious view that if they are innocent why would they not answer any and every question. The Portuguese law that prevents them discussing the case with the media will not help them in convincing the public that they are innocent.
As to which media report you believe, I am of the opinion that one should always consider the source when deciding the accuracy of a report. I have no knowledge of the trustworthiness of foreign press but have little or no faith in British papers such as the Mirror or the Sun - both have been guilty in the past of sensationalism and, in the case of the Mirror, downright lying. I use a number of sources and form my opinion on that. I am also wary when the media say “a source” without naming that source. That could be anything from a senior police officer to a man walking his dog! As an example, the Daily Express today states that Lincolnshire social services visited the McCanns to check on the welfare of the twins yet other media reports state that the visit was one normally carried out when a British citizen is being investigated in a foreign country. There have also been media reports that the McCanns have been blocked from using the Find Madeleine fund to pay for their legal fees, yet the Daily Mail reported yesterday that the McCanns themselves had decided not to use the fund for that purpose.
Should the Portuguese police ask them to return for questioning, I doubt that they will be able to refuse as a European arrest warrant would be issued and the U.K. will legally have to abide by that.
September 14th, 2007 at 9:39 am
I think that some of the comments made by some regarding Sandra are unjustified. I too question the McCanns’ methodology employed to “Find Madeline Campaign” partcularly,as I am aware of the tools employed by the Media to convey a story. Thus, I endeavour to keep an open mind. However, I am perturbed by the fact that certain posters resort to personal attackes when alternative opinions are expressed.
The Guardian 12/09/07 = Jonathan Freedland’s comments eloquently described the situation.
Madeleine: a grimly compelling story that will end badly for us all. We’re divided and now confused by the McCann investigation - and in real danger of losing our common decency
Visit the Sky News website and you’ll see in the menu of topics the single word Madeleine, sandwiched between UK News and World News. The story is now so big that it commands its own category, on a par with Politics or Business….
But last week brought a dizzying twist, one that has left the watching public badly confused. The notion of a predatory stranger seizing Madeleine McCann was terrifying but uncomplicated: we knew how we were supposed to feel. The naming by Portuguese police of the little girl’s parents as formal suspects has obliged us to contemplate not an ancient fear but a grave taboo: infanticide.
Of course, the grim reality is that cases of parents slaying their young are all too common…The branding of the McCanns as suspects allows for no such lazy response. Their campaign enjoyed such widespread press backing in part because they are the very model of a middle-class, professional couple: both are doctors, still society’s most trusted group…Even to conceive of them as the suspected killers of the daughter whose loss they have been grieving is to experience cognitive dissonance.
Which is why people don’t know how to react. Suddenly we have to hold two entirely contradictory thoughts in our head at the same time. For the McCanns have now either suffered the cruellest fate imaginable - not only to have innocently lost their beloved daughter but also to have been publicly accused of a wicked crime - or they are guilty of the most elaborate and heinous confidence trick in history, deceitfully winning the trust and sympathy of the world’s media, a British prime minister, the wife of the American president and even the Pope, to say nothing of international public opinion. One of those statements, both of them extraordinary, describes the truth. As a senior tabloid journalist put it to me yesterday: “They’re either the victims of a horrible smear which they will never fully escape or they are cold, psychotic killers” responsible for the death of their own child.
Note the headlines in the Sun and the Mirror, carefully surrounded by caveats and qualifiers, just in case the other scenario proves to be true.This is not how stories like this usually play out. Ordinarily, the popular papers, in particular, have a hunch about the culprit (and very often their hunches are right). Not this time, however. The press pack following the McCann case is apparently split into two camps, for and against the couple, with some reporters refusing to speak to those on the other side. One tabloid editor is changing his mind on where guilt lies “on an hourly basis”.
It’s easy to see why. Yesterday it was reported that the Portuguese police had found not just the odd DNA trace in the boot of the McCanns’ hire car - rented weeks after Madeleine’s disappearance - but substantial amounts of the child’s hair and even bodily fluids. Suddenly, an entire narrative assembles itself, built from leaked nuggets and speculative fragments, which runs as follows. The McCanns had sedated their children so that they could have an undisturbed dinner with friends (hence the failure of the two younger McCann children to awake even during the loud chaos of the night of May 3). They returned to find Madeleine dead. Fearing their twins would be taken from them if they confessed the truth, they hid Madeleine’s body, then hid it again in the spare wheel compartment of their rented car until finally burying it somewhere else. (Where? The anti-McCann view even has an answer to this question. Portuguese police are reported to be planning to search the Our Lady of the Light church in Praia da Luz, where the McCanns prayed regularly and to which they were given the keys, so they might visit day or night. Detectives are said to be set on digging up an area around the church - including one cobbled street where roadworks were under way when Madeleine disappeared.)
It hangs together well enough until you start asking questions. How could two people under constant media scrutiny possibly have carried out and hidden their daughter’s body without being seen? If they really had concealed a corpse in their car, wouldn’t the smell have been obvious? How could two people unfamiliar with the local landscape have found an eventual hiding place that would still, months later, remain undiscovered? Is it plausible to imagine that, in the moments after suffering the trauma of a dead child, two people could have constructed such an elaborate cover-up plan, executed it coolly and remained steady ever since? Could anybody maintain this front, a global lie, for so long without cracking?…
How will this story end? That’s what makes it so grimly compelling: none of us knows. Until we do, basic justice demands that we presume the McCanns are wholly innocent. Common decency demands the same. For if they are eventually found guilty, there will be plenty of time for condemnation. But if they are innocent, to presume otherwise is to commit a second crime against people who have already suffered enough.
September 14th, 2007 at 8:56 am
interesting stuff expat.
And I agree she has pointed fingers - all the way.
I believe it was an inside job. But that’s just me.
September 14th, 2007 at 8:49 am
The people in this crime ring, reported by the Guardian and others, were are all rich influential Portuguese. Sandra is a rich portuguese. Sandra has written loads of stuff to try and point the finger at the parents.
I wonder whether we will hear any more from the angel ‘Sandra’ now?