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1. 625 Jolie says:
   October 7th, 2007 at 10:55 pm

   Here’s a link to the Scotland on Sunday article I should have put in my very recent post:

   http://scotlandonsunday.scotsman.com/index.cfm?id=1520772007

   The article talks about the shifting public image of the McCanns and discusses Clarence Mitchell’s impact on it.

2. 624 Jolie says:
   October 7th, 2007 at 10:53 pm

   From a Sept 23 article in Scotland on Sunday:

   QUOTE
   But by the time they were named as suspects on September 7 many close to them had advised them to return to the UK for the sake of their legal defence and their worsening public image.
   UNQUOTE

   But I thought the McCanns’ reason for returning to England was out of concern for their twins having a more normal life?!

   Just evidence of the McCanns being caught at being disingenuous.

   Of course, the REAL reason is that they were afraid one or both of them would soon be locked up in Portugal and they needed to put some distance between them and the PJ.

3. 623 Manon says:
   October 7th, 2007 at 10:53 pm

   Carmen Says:
   October 7th, 2007 at 10:18 pm

   Quote: No! Dora, and No! Manon
   Manon referred to the ‘ the slack sexual offender laws in Portugal’ - to try to turn that round now into a ‘if only the had a sex offender register all this would be solved’ and then to link it to the orphanage scandal is - luditosh.
   A register would have made no difference to the orphanage scandal - these perpetrators had never been previously convicted. Yes, agreed that is how the Payne murderer was caught, but conversely, had he never been previously convicted, it wouldn’t have been. Manon’s argument was that a paedophile was ‘more likely’ than a kidnapper specifically because of the ’slack offender laws’.

   The presence or absence of a register makes the likelihood of this abduction being by a paedophile neither more nor less likely - it only affects the probability of capture if the perpetrator was previously convicted of such an offence.
   So, I ask Manon once again.
   Why do you think that a paedophile was more likely?

   Reply:
   I actually said that a paedophile is more likely than a ransom kidnapper *because there has been no ransom* & women who kidnap because they want a child usually get found (she would probably be a local), PLUS there is no sex offender register.

   Look - Holly & Jessica Wells - Ian Huntley had previous accusations (tho not convictions) of sex with underage girls. The bath rape girl from the NE - Voidey had previous conviction for molesting 12 year old girl. Sophia Hook’s murderer - Howard Hughes - had been previously charged with raping a 14 year old girl. Sarah Payne, Roy Whiting had previous charges.

   So a register *helps*, non? Trawling the area for registered sex offenders & building a psychological profile for possible suspects - is the first thing police do in a case like this - and you can’t if there isn’t one.

   Quote:
   I said ‘What I do think is that the McCann’s are people who are famous for having ‘mislaid’ their child, and who are now supported by a fund which was donated to by people who intended the money to be used to help search for Madeleine.

   Your reply: Well that’s quite silly enough(and anti-factual) for me Caribbean cruises or no.

   Specifically, what is silly, and what is anti-factual?
   (1)that the McCann’s are now famous for having ‘mislaid’ their child? Were they famous before? No. What was the event that made them famous? Loosing their child.
   Or (2) perhaps that they are now supported, which they are, quite legitimately, by the fund?

   I believe that Caribbean cruises and was it Porches, were your suggestion, certainly not.

   Reply:
   Anti-factual because * they are not being supported by the fund* in the way that you claim - the money is being used to find Madeleine - it is supporting *their efforts* to find her - eg: ad campaigns etc. It’s not even being spent on their legal fees. If I had donated to the fund I would have no beef with what they’re spending their money on.

   And really talking about them having “mislaid their child” is just supercilious. If it happened to you - and in a way it should, just to wipe the smirk off your face - you would not appreciate people talking about you so.

4. 622 thea says:
   October 7th, 2007 at 10:52 pm

   roger there are different types of abuse. if you mean were k&g physically beating madeleine? no. is it possible there was another kind of abuse? i think yes it is possible. i had asked earlier about a comment i heard from gerry’s own lips. unless the interview was tampered with i have to believe what i heard nad to me the comment is odd. he told the reporter madeleine was “near perfect”. i believe gerry is a very controlling narcissistic individual. they expect perfection and nothing less from their wife/husband and children. this is why narcissists are forever dissappointed in those around them. they are always finding fault with others.

5. 621 Tony Bennett says:
   October 7th, 2007 at 10:49 pm

   ===============================
   WERE THE SHUTTERS ‘JEMMIED UP’?
   ===============================

   The PJ said ‘No’. And the PJ said the windows were opened ‘from the inside’.

   But Gerry McCann said differently, when he ‘phoned his wife’s father to tell him that Madeleine had been abducted. This from ‘The Guardian’ on 5 May:

   QUOTE

   The grandfather of a three-year-old snatched from her parents’ holiday apartment in the Algarve said yesterday that there was clear evidence she had been abducted.

   Police helicopters flew over Praia de la Luz yesterday as the hunt intensified for Madeleine McCann, who went missing from her bedroom in the apartment on Thursday night.

   Teams of officers used sniffer dogs to scour the resort, in the south-west of Portugal, where Gerald McCann, a cardiac surgeon, and his wife Kate, had taken their three young children - Madeleine and her younger brother and sister, who are twins - for a week-long holiday.

   Mark Warner, the holiday firm which runs the luxury resort, claimed last night there was no sign of a break in at the ground floor apartment overlooking the sea.

   But Brian Healy, Madeleine’s maternal grandfather, told the Guardian his son-in-law had phoned him shortly after returning to the apartment from a nearby restaurant to find Madeleine had disappeared.

   “Gerry told me when they went back the shutters to the room were broken, they were jemmied up and she was gone,” said Mr Healy. “She’d been taken from the chalet. The door was open.”

   UNQUOTE

   You have a very simple choice on the shutters.

   1. You can believe Gerry McCann, or

   2. You can believe the PJ and Mark Warners.

   It’s on the multiplicity of discrepancies like this that we, the McCann-sceptics, have constructed, brick by brick, discrepancy by discrepancy, our edifice of scepticism as to whether the McCanns are telling us the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth

6. 620 Andrew says:
   October 7th, 2007 at 10:48 pm

   thea, you cracked it. This guy is Magnum off the telly. sounds right. the Ferrari GTO’s been refitted like KIT from knight rider. That’s how he tracks kids with DNA and GSM
   Wow!! Where the hell is hasselhoff?? He’s gonna be SO jealous

7. 619 Roger says:
   October 7th, 2007 at 10:44 pm

   May I be challenging. I think for accidental death and Mccann involvement there would have to be a history of “abuse”. Any reason to think there is?

8. 618 Andrew says:
   October 7th, 2007 at 10:44 pm

   Maybe this Krugel guy is like a Germanic-Apache Indian Nomad descendent, and he followed a trail of displaced tarmac chippings, cosmic aura energy trails and “footprints in the sand” using his laptop. Maybe he’s an acid casualty from the 60’s. Who knows. Maybe he wants some of the Millions and a quick fumble opportunity. Um, I mean photo opportunity.
   Nobody knows. Probably not even him.

9. 617 thea says:
   October 7th, 2007 at 10:41 pm

   so is the story a leak by uk press? why would the mccanns have hired someone who is a pi with a poor record?

10. 616 Judge Dread says:
    October 7th, 2007 at 10:36 pm

    Mary it is science fiction. The girls he claimed to have found in South Africa had been dead so long hair would have rotted to nothing.

    It would be impossible to find a trail of single fine blonde hairs unless every inch was searched on his knees with a magnfying glass.

11. 615 thea says:
    October 7th, 2007 at 10:35 pm

    manon,

    i don’t wish for anyone to send me charity. i was raised by a family who taught to do for oneself was the greater joy than expecting hand-outs from others. we were also taught to share. seeing there are so many families not nearly as connected or financially blessed as the mccanns it begger’s belief they cannot see it to extend their resources in hopes of finding other missing children from portugal-spain-uk.

    it is odd that many mccan supporters on anorak wrongly assume those of us questioning their motives are jealous.

    i am not jelaous of anyone. if i’ve ever been envious of anyone when i was younger you can be sure it wasa not of people like the mccanns who do not have common sense and are narcissistic.

12. 614 Judge Dread says:
    October 7th, 2007 at 10:31 pm

    Tony Bennett - You say “To clarify further, I do not think this was ‘just an accident’, nor do I think it was deliberate, premeditated murder”

    What comes between the two?

    If she died accidently there was no intent. If she didn’t die accidently there must be intent and it can only be murder. There is no inbetween.

13. 613 mary says:
    October 7th, 2007 at 10:31 pm

    587 judge dread

    It sounds cranky to us but the press are treating it as some sort of tested science. I presume this is because the Mccanns seem to be behind it.
    If this device really was tried and tested to good result Krugal would be a very wealthy man and Eddie and Keela and co redundant. Is there really a machine that can tract people by their hair and determine whether they were living or dead after many months? Sounds like science fiction to me so why sudden silence from the “ludicrous” brigade!

14. 612 thea says:
    October 7th, 2007 at 10:29 pm

    question about the comments by promc’s the mccanns were advised against giving out too much specific information about madeleine, including any video of her speaking. if this is true was it pj who advised this strategy? also, why mention her colomba? why create and trademark a design based on her colomba?

15. 611 Manon says:
    October 7th, 2007 at 10:27 pm

    thea Says:
    October 7th, 2007 at 10:11 pm

    manon,

    i don’t know what they’re using the fund money on but you need to double check your facts. the mccanns stayed on in portugal for free - their villa accomodations were covered by mark warner resorts. flight to the vatican was another donation from a uk billionaire. their stay in rome was financed by a friend of the mccanns or of clarence mitchell. currently much of their expenses are paid for by others ie, anonymous backers and gullible do gooders.

    there is a a”secret” code in gerry’s blog. it spells out: send money. and manon you might be interested to know gerry has mis-spelled madeleine’s name on his blog more than once and I find several typos and grammar errors in Anorak’s news columns frequently. i don’t believe this indicates lack of education but laziness to use word/grammar check. although in ger’s case it could postively illustrate his malignant self-obsession.

    ******************************************************************

    Well there was someone on here claiming that the McCanns had spent £300,000 on villa rental so it depends where you get your facts from.
    I thought they paid some of the villa rental themselves, which shows I don’t read my journals du choix carefully enough.

    You really have to leave the “gullible” do-gooders to do what they want with their money. I know you (all) wish it was coming to you personally - and that’s part of your beef with the McCanns, but it ain’t. (In fact I assume that the obsession that the McCanns purloining the money is because you would be tempted yourself). Despite what you read in the tabloids (or do you just make this stuff up?) it isn’t going to them personally either.

    I’m glad you’ve decoded the secret message in Gerry’s blog.

    If I had a blog my secret message to you would be: sectioning is required.

    I’ve noticed typos/spellos & grammar errors in Anorak’s columns too & I pop on here to correct them: he’s trying to send a secret code to Ptaah & should be stopped. Nanoo.

16. 610 Tony Bennett says:
    October 7th, 2007 at 10:26 pm

    The Net is bursting at the seams with McCann-sceptical comments. Here’s three comments, made in sequence, that I picked out at random on another - pro-McCann - Forum today:

    1. “OF COURSE the parents killed her. Even the original story they told to the police was nonsense and their own friends that they had the tapas party with did not back them up at all. Do I think it was an accident? Yes. Do I think that they should tell the truth and stop wasting our time? Yes”.

    2. ” These people are both respected physicians. They had no good reason to fabricate a story”.

    3. “They have every reason to fabricate a story. They are respected physicians, they like their freedom, family, lifestyle, reputations, and they don’t want to go to prison”.

17. 609 Jolie says:
    October 7th, 2007 at 10:24 pm

    McCanns: Keep hunting for Madeleine
    United Presss International October 7, 2007

    http://www.upi.com/NewsTrack/Top_News/2007/10/07/mccanns_keep_hunting_for_madeleine/7304/

    QUOTE
    LONDON, Oct. 7 (UPI) — Madeleine McCann’s parents are urging Portuguese police to continue hunting for their daughter even as the investigation scales back to three detectives.

    Kate and Gerry McCann of Rothley, England, reportedly are furious at police claims their daughter is dead, The Telegraph reported Sunday.

    “Of course we accept it’s possible Madeleine may no longer be alive but we don’t know and nor do the police, so we have to do everything we can to find her,” Kate McCann told friends, according to the British newspaper.

    Only three detectives remain on the case after the dismissal of chief investigator Goncalo Amaral, who was pulled from the case after publicly accusing British police of being manipulated by the McCanns, who have been named suspects in Madeleine’s May 3 disappearance from a vacation apartment in Praia da Luz.

    Family friends said the McCanns have found it nearly unbearable to hear police may have given up looking for their daughter, who now would be four years old.
    UNQUOTE

    If it weren’t for the possibility that there might be a living little girl out there needing help, I’d like to tell the McCanns to go pee up a rope. They couldn’t be bothered to ensure their own flesh and blood were well cared for during their holiday evenings and instead were careless with their lives, thereby losing one of them.

    Now they expect the world to fund the search (and their living expenses), and for Portugal to devote their resources to a never-ending search for one child (which they allegedly have evidence of having died before 10 pm May 3). And they become indignant when they think others aren’t doing their best. Well, guess what Mr. and Mrs. McCann, you certainly weren’t doing your best in the parenting department and for that, you should be ashamed and for all the trouble you have caused because of your negligence (or worse) and be grateful for the help you have received so far.

    If they don’t think the PJ are doing a good job, what can be said of their own private investigators, funded from the Find Madeleine Fund that have supposedly been on the case for months or their own legal team who is (have they started) interviewing all the witnesses, etc., pertinent to the case. Why are the McCanns worried about the PJs no longer searching for Madeleine if they have all these top-notch private resources available to do it for them?

    It doesn’t make sense unless this cry for the PJ to keep looking for Madeleine is solely because they want to keep pressuring the PJ to turn their attention from them as suspects and search outwards. Or perhaps the reason is that they really don’t have people searching and investigating independent of the PJ and that’s all been a bluff.

    How many detectives each are working on each of the other thousands of missing kids’ cases in the EU or the US or elsewhere in the world, once the initial search and investigation cools off? It’s been 6 months since Madeleine disappeared. During the early months, 200 detectives were on the case (I believe I read that yesterday). The PJs devoted a lot of time and human resources toward finding Madeleine, but they shouldn’t be expected to devote an inordinate amount of time and money to the case forever, particularly on what they believe to be a dead end.

    I think the McCanns are arrogant and self-centered to believe they and Madeleine are the center of the world. Of course, they have a lot of help from the people and media of Britain in believing that.

    If Mr. and Mrs. McCann want to do something truly useful with their high profile status, they should post photos and information of recent missing children on their website and talk about these kids and their families (with the families’ permission, of course) during media interviews. Everyone who is reading/watching the press already knows what Maddie looks like. How about giving a helping hand to those families who don’t have a tiny fraction of the resources you have, Mr. and Mrs. McCann? It wouldn’t take much effort and something beautiful might come of it.

18. 608 thea says:
    October 7th, 2007 at 10:23 pm

    this idea that padeo registry deters future crimes against children or makes crimes easier to solve is ridiculous. besides when was the registry created in the uk? have crimes against children slowed down since its inception? have crimes against children been easier to solve? how goes the torso in the thames’ case? rhys jones?

    i think the fact is if madeleine was abducted by a paedo it is almost guaranteed the paedo is of northern european background.

19. 607 thea says:
    October 7th, 2007 at 10:18 pm

    yes tony agreed: gerry lost it. and who knows how many other times he lost it? since gerry is angry about having to pay someone for their time and expertise i wonder if gerry worked as a cardiology consultant probono? or did he expect to be paid as well?

20. 606 thea says:
    October 7th, 2007 at 10:14 pm

    batman,

    maybe krissie is the only pro-mc from a democracy, properly educated and knows how to vote?

21. 605 Manon says:
    October 7th, 2007 at 10:12 pm

    Andrew Says:
    October 7th, 2007 at 10:06 pm
    Quote:

    We want Tony Bennett for Labour Prime Minister. I’m impressed by his cynicism and lust for facts.

    ******************************************************************

    Are you? I’m impressed by his total lack of touch with reality.

    To wit: “but as certain as I can be that Madeleine died in the apartment.”

    O rly? How certain is that - for someone who has *never been to the scene*, been party to none of the investigation, and has no idea what the actual ‘evidence’ dna & otherwise amounts to?

22. 604 Tony Bennett says:
    October 7th, 2007 at 10:11 pm

    GERRY ‘LOST HIS RAG’

    I see that amid the reports that Gerry was ‘livid’, ‘furious’ and ‘hit the roof’ over his PR lady’s extravagent expenses claim, one paper has him ‘losing his rag’.

    I think we get the picture.

    He lost it.

23. 603 thea says:
    October 7th, 2007 at 10:11 pm

    manon,

    i don’t know what they’re using the fund money on but you need to double check your facts. the mccanns stayed on in portugal for free - their villa accomodations were covered by mark warner resorts. flight to the vatican was another donation from a uk billionaire. their stay in rome was financed by a friend of the mccanns or of clarence mitchell. currently much of their expenses are paid for by others ie, anonymous backers and gullible do gooders.

    there is a a”secret” code in gerry’s blog. it spells out: send money. and manon you might be interested to know gerry has mis-spelled madeleine’s name on his blog more than once and I find several typos and grammar errors in Anorak’s news columns frequently. i don’t believe this indicates lack of education but laziness to use word/grammar check. although in ger’s case it could postively illustrate his malignant self-obsession.

24. 602 Batman says:
    October 7th, 2007 at 10:10 pm

    Ade - so 19 out of 20 people think Kate and Gerrypops know more than they are letting on.

25. 601 Batman says:
    October 7th, 2007 at 10:09 pm

    Ade - and of the 3 that support abduction, 2 are suggesting parental involvement. Interesting. But wonder why the pros are not voting.

26. 600 Ade says:
    October 7th, 2007 at 10:09 pm

    619 ok 17 out of 20

27. 599 Ade says:
    October 7th, 2007 at 10:07 pm

    616 ooops 16 out of 19… and rising?

28. 598 Andrew says:
    October 7th, 2007 at 10:06 pm

    Can’t we just politely ask paedo’s weirdos and murderers to please stop?

    Never mind Tony Benn… We want Tony Bennett for Labour Prime Minister. I’m impressed by his cynicism and lust for facts.

    Number Ten? No thanks!
    Why not go for a job at the Hague? we could all have real fun then.

29. 597 Swannie says:
    October 7th, 2007 at 10:05 pm

    To vote, copy and paste this post to your comments box, then add your name to the list for the scenario you believe to be true and increase the number by 1.

    Wandered Off - 0

    Abduction - 1,
    Krissie

    Hoax Abduction - 2
    Judge Dread, Susannah

    Accidental Death - 13
    Ade, Carmen, Brandonflours, Amarality Tale, DeeDeeDee, Jolie, Will, Batman, Petrocelli, Julie, Rosemary,peck, Swannie

    Murder -3
    Lilith, Roger, Judith C

    Unexplained death in the apartment followed by false abduction claim - 1
    Tony Bennett

30. 596 Ade says:
    October 7th, 2007 at 10:05 pm

    614 et al.

    the point about the poll to me is not the detail of the cause of death but the fact that 15 out of 18 votes come down on the side of death and only 3 support abduction…

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