Madeleine McCann: The Scenic 17, Dr Denny Says And DNA
MADDY WATCH - Anorak’s at-a-glance guide to press coverage of Madeleine McCann
DAILY EXPRESS page 21: “New DNA tests could unlock the mystery of lost Madeleine”
More DNA tests at the Forensic Science Service laboratory in Birmingham And this after the DNA tests proved inconclusive…
“Seventeen human cells could provide a major breakthrough in the Madeleine McCann mystery…The DNA samples are being examined by scientists in Britain and Portuguese detectives believe the evidence could unlock an investigation which is now in its eighth month”
The Tapas 7. The Tapas 9. The Scenic 17…
Guilhermino Encarnacao, head of the Policia Judiciaria in the Algarve, says: “We have asked the laboratory to carry out more tests and exhaust every possibility of obtaining conclusive results”
Says Forensic scientist Dr Ronald Denny (not working on the case): “A cell is negligible – you can just about see it under a microscope. It’s a sample someone would leave behind with the touch of a finger. But when placed with certain biochemicals a small amount of DNA grows to a size that can be analysed”
“GP Kate and heart consultant Gerry” are “both 39”
THE SUN page 15: “Only 17 cells of DNA in hol car”
“Cops looking for Madeleine McCann are banking on ‘a smidgen’ of DNA evidence. Scientists have found just 17 cells on samples taken from a hire car rented by Kate and Gerry McCann and their holiday flat”
Says independent forensic expert Dr Ronald Denny: “It is not a hopeless task. If they have 17 cells then they can carry it off very effectively in Birmingham, one of the leading labs in the world”
DAILY MAIL page 5: “Mission Impossible – Forensic evidence too poor to solve mystery of Madeleine, say police”
But Dr Denny is telling two papers otherwise…
A source tells Portuguese newspaper 24 Horas: “It is highly unlikely they will find a DNA connection…If everybody refuses to make statements, which is perfectly possible, we will be left with our hands tied. This is a case which could hang by a thread for years and we may never be able to prove what actually happened to that child”
But what about Dr Denny. Why don’t they ask Dr Denny?
Says Dr Denny: “A person, or their possessions, have to be present for the cells to come off”
DAILY MIRROR page 7: “Maddy: Smidgen of DNA will work?”
Dr Denny is on the case, or not. But the “independent British expert” does have an opinion which is able to share with all of us
DAILY STAR page 9: “MADDIE: IT’S ALL DOWN TO 17 CELLS”
Dr Denny is talking to Star readers…
“Top cop in blast at private eyes” – Former deputy chief constable of Manchester Police John Stalker says of Metodo 3: “I’m not impressed with these people at all. I’d be very surprised if they get anywhere”
This is the same Stalker who delivered “MY VERDICT” to Express reader back in October
“There’s a world of difference in following a paper chase and finding a flesh-and-blood child”
Or a newspaper chase…
DAILY TELEGRAPH page 11: “Madeleine tests are ‘mission impossible’”
Says a source in 24 Horas: “The samples reportedly include microscopic spots of blood from the Ocean Club apartment where Madeleine went missing and ‘bodily fluids’ and hair from the Renault Scenic hired by the McCanns 25 days after their daughter’s disappearance. The samples are so small that, while it will not be impossible to find a DNA link between the car, apartment and Madeleine, it’s highly unlikely The tests being carried out are extremely complex”
But Dr Denny says…
Says Clarence Mitchell: “Kate and Gerry’s friends have consistently said they are happy to be re-interviewed by police if necessary. Indeed, they are keen to help if it clears up any inconsistencies. They, like Gerry and Kate, have nothing to hide”
THE GUARDIAN and THE INDEPENDENT: “No Madeleine news today
Posted: 4th, December 2007 | In: Broadsheets Comments (1,344) | Follow the Comments on our RSS feed: RSS 2.0 | TrackBack | Permalink
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December 4th, 2007 at 3:09 pm
376 Tinsel
Yes I agree. And remember, we don’t know what was said in the original 16 hours of questions directed at Kate. I can’t for one minute believe that Kate and/or Gerry said absolutely nothing in those interviews. Plus we now know that Kate was text messaging from inside the police station - clearly something not going to be in her favour at all.
December 4th, 2007 at 3:07 pm
368
Salomon ES Says:
December 4th, 2007 at 2:55 pm
357 - Tinsel
I wish i could read the original El Mundo article to clarify this detail.
****
Here is the translation:
The World, Wednesday December 3, 2007
‘Case Maddie’: the siege narrows
The wiretapping involving Gerry McCann and also Russell O’Brien, which would become suspect
LONDON - Seven months after the night he disappeared mysteriously Madeleine McCann his bed, police Portuguese seemed closer than ever to solving the case, which so much ink and money has caused. After a surprise visit to Elderby, Police Headquarters Leicestershire (UK), which depend Kate and Gerry McCann, the Portuguese authorities are preparing to return to question a group of nine British are at the heart of the mystery.
After cooperating with the British authorities, the Portuguese Judicial Police will be required to travel to England the next few weeks, with the aim of interrogating both Gerry and Kate McCann and seven of his friends with the parents of Maddie were having dinner the night of May 3.
The meeting Elderby between the Portuguese and British police in the presence of various specialists in forensics, served to reinforce the line of research equipment Paulo Rebelo continues since last July and which led to consider as arguidos ( suspects) marriage McCann.
The Portuguese Judicial Police still suspecting that Kate and Gerry McCann hid the body of her daughter, Madeleine, and simulated his abduction. A broad allegation that two other suspects, Robert and Russell Murat O’Brien. Contrary to what many thought so far, the Judicial Police has in its possession more evidence that simple DNA analysis.
According to various testimonies, available, for example, from the list of telephone calls made by the marriage McCann and his friends, and known also as the recipients of those calls and, in some cases, the exact content of the talks conducted by all members of the group.
The call that most intrigo the Portuguese police took place on June 10 between Russell O’Brien and Gerry McCann. The father of Maddie assure initially to the police that the call had been made from a location four kilometers from Ocean Club. However, listening to the calls and triangulating antennas enabled the Portuguese police, in collaboration with technicians British verify that such claims were false.
The place from where the call was made and the content of the signs are missing and the police want to explore in interrogations, which could lead to the rapid location of the body of Madeleine.
The triangulation of calls has enabled the police discovered an abandoned barn, where there was a towel stained with blood and debris from the trunk of Renault Scénic rented by McCann.
In addition, several videos and various photographs are part of the summary, particularly some showing that Murat already knew the group members. Aside from the strange coincidence that Murat had been in Exeter, where residents then Russell O’Brien and Jane Tanner, the police received from his British colleagues various elements that can prove that Gerry McCann and Robert Murat had already been seen and spoken on several occasions, even before the McCann travel to Praia da Luz.
A source close to the Attorney can confirm that there is sufficient evidence, regardless of the DNA test, to make formal accusations. But that decision was taken only after the interrogation, and near the end of the period after which the summary of the case ceases to be secret.
With the strengthening of the line of the investigation and the suspicions of the police on the Portuguese McCann, investigators have eight months to concluís content. From that moment, the process is made public, according to the new penal code Portuguese.
The situation of Robert Murat, Gerry and Kate could therefore worsen. Indeed, Murat was declared a suspect or arguido on May 14 and, therefore, his eight-month period ending in January. Marriage McCann was declared a suspect on September 7, which, in his case, the term expiring in May.
_________________
“If she is dead then she is dead but not by their hand,” a friend said
December 4th, 2007 at 3:07 pm
370
SteveT Says:
December 4th, 2007 at 2:57 pm
366
Lone Pigeon
There are reasons that I can not go into right now as to why I got hammered. IMO
I hope they’re wholly innocent explanations!
December 4th, 2007 at 3:06 pm
The original article by the Telegraaf in Amsterdam was released on June 13:
http://tinyurl.com/2gz97y
Interestingly they say in that article that they weren’t going to publish the actual letter that was sent to the paper.
December 4th, 2007 at 3:06 pm
368
Salomon ES Says:
December 4th, 2007 at 2:55 pm
357 - Tinsel
I wish i could read the original El Mundo article to clarify this detail. Unlike the Express, the French version of the El Mundo article published in SOS Madeleine is not so conclusive as to WHO actually called WHO. (Frankly I trust El Mundo is a lot more accurate than the Express).
***
Okay, you asked for it … sorry to everyone these are long posts:
Here’s the original:
El Mundo, Lunes 3 de Diciembre de 2007
‘Caso Maddie’ : se estrecha el cerco
Las escuchas telefónicas implican a Gerry McCann y también a Russel O’Brien, que pasaría a ser sospechoso
LONDRES.- Siete meses después de la noche en que Madeleine McCann desapareció misteriosamente de su cama, la policía portuguesa parece mas cerca que nunca de la solución del caso, que tanta tinta y dinero, ha hecho correr. Tras una visita sorpresa a Elderby, sede de la policía de Leicestershire (Reino Unido), de la que dependen Kate y Gerry McCann, las autoridades portuguesas se preparan para volver a interrogar al grupo de los nueve británicos que están en el centro del misterio.
Tras cooperar con las autoridades inglesas, la Policía Judicial portuguesa tendrá que viajar a Inglaterra las próximas semanas, con el objetivo de interrogar tanto a Gerry y Kate McCann como a siete de sus amigos, con los que los padres de Maddie estaban cenando la noche del día 3 de mayo.
La reunión de Elderby, entre la policía portuguesa y británica con la presencia de diversos especialistas de la policía científica, sirvió para reforzar la línea de investigación que el equipo de Paulo Rebelo sigue desde el pasado mes de julio y que condujo a considerar como arguidos (sospechosos) al matrimonio McCann.
La Policía Judicial portuguesa sigue sospechando que Kate y Gerry McCann escondieron el cadáver de su hija, Madeleine, y simularon su secuestro. Una imputación que amplia a otros dos sospechosos, Robert Murat y Russell O’Brien. En contra de lo que muchos pensaban hasta ahora, la Policía Judicial tiene en su poder más elementos probatorios que los simples análisis del ADN.
Según diversos testimonios, dispone, por ejemplo, de la lista de las llamadas telefónicas efectuadas por el matrimonio McCann y sus amigos, y conoce, asimismo, as los destinatarios de esas llamadas y, en algunos casos, el contenido exacto de las conversaciones realizadas por todos los miembros del grupo.
La llamada que más intrigo a la policía portuguesa tuvo lugar el día 10 de junio entre Russell O’Brien y Gerry McCann. El padre de Maddie aseguro inicialmente a la policía que la llamada había sido realizada desde un lugar situado a cuatro kilómetros del Ocean Club. Sin embargo, las escuchas de las llamadas y la triangulación de las antenas permitió a la policía portuguesa, en colaboración con los técnicos británicos, comprobar que tales afirmaciones eran falsas.
El lugar desde donde se hizo esa llamada y el contenido de la misma son los indicios que faltaban y que la policía quiere explorar en los interrogatorios, que podrían conducir a la rápida localización del cuerpo de Madeleine.
La triangulación de las llamadas ha permitido que la policía descubra un granero abandonado, donde se encontró una toalla manchada de sangre y residuos procedentes del maletero del Renault Scénic alquilado por los McCann.
Además, varios videos y diversas fotografías forman parte del sumario, especialmente algunas que demuestran que Murat ya conocía a los miembros del grupo. Aparte de la extraña coincidencia de que Murat hubiera estado en Exeter, el lugar donde residían entonces Russel O’Brien y Jane Tanner, la policía recibió de sus colegas británicos diversos elementos que pueden probar que Gerry McCann y Robert Murat ya se habían visto y hablado en diversas ocasiones, incluso antes de que los McCann viajasen a Praia da Luz.
Una fuente cercana a la Fiscalía confirmo que existen pruebas suficientes, independientemente de los test de ADN, para poder realizar las acusaciones oficiales. Pero esa decisión solo se tomara después de los interrogatorios y ya cerca del final del plazo tras el cual el sumario del caso dejara de ser secreto.
Con el reforzamiento de la línea de la investigación y de las sospechas de la policía portuguesa sobre los McCann, los investigadores disponen de ocho meses para concluís el sumario. A partir de ese momento, el proceso se hace público, según el nuevo Código penal portugués.
La situación de Robert Murat, Gerry y Kate podría, pues, agravarse. En efecto, Murat fue declarado sospechoso o arguido el día 14 de mayo y, por lo tanto, sus ocho meses de plazo terminan en enero. El matrimonio McCann fue declarado sospechoso el día 7 de septiembre, con lo que, en su caso, el plazo terminaría en el mes de mayo.
December 4th, 2007 at 3:06 pm
95
brandon flours Says:
December 4th, 2007 at 11:19 am
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=RJyR3d7jjHo
————————————————–
evil—– but good
December 4th, 2007 at 3:05 pm
Drunk Brandon Drunk! I love the photo on this thread. Kates pose - it’s like - ‘Bloody hell Gerry, you can’t even operate a bloody suitcase’. C’mon we’ve gotta get out of here’.
December 4th, 2007 at 3:02 pm
I learned on a show about the Hillside Strangler that a pathological liar will always have more than one alibi. Rather than stick with one lock-tight alibi, they will begin to come up with another. Strange trait.
JT seems to be embellishing as she goes along. GM too.
Not that I think they are pathological — I think they are just garden variety liars. The stubborn type that will lie until they die, but I do think the police know that time is on their side as liars are determined to prove themselves, talk too much, embellish. I do think the McCs have been warned not to embellish, but it is only human nature.
December 4th, 2007 at 3:02 pm
371 Ian
Any luck with the VAT number?
December 4th, 2007 at 3:01 pm
368
Salomon ES
I find it odd that Gerry would use km instead of miles. The only people I’ve met from the UK that I know will use km are ex-military who lived in mainland Europe. How many Brits go to Spain/Portugal etc. and will talk in terms of kilometres? Not many.
Having said that, Gerry does say that Huelva is 50km over the border into Spain.
Just strange for a Brit to talk about metric distances…
December 4th, 2007 at 2:58 pm
nail him?
oh lord !!!
theres an epidemic going on
December 4th, 2007 at 2:57 pm
360 Salomon ES
“A well-informed local real estate developer could have given you the indications to find an abandoned property on your way to Lisbon - no problem at all.”
Hmmmm you mean like Mr Murat?
Also, the blog on June 11 looks in doubt. If you read his blog on June 14 he refers to the article “released yesterday” in the Dutch newspaper. On June 11 he refers to it as well. Clearly the blog on June 11 is wrong or he typed it when he got back to PDL.
December 4th, 2007 at 2:57 pm
I reckon McCann will get away with this and then write a book call ‘How I sedated the authorities’ by Gerry McCann and then they’ll nail him.
December 4th, 2007 at 2:57 pm
366
Lone Pigeon
There are reasons that I can not go into right now as to why I got hammered. IMO
December 4th, 2007 at 2:56 pm
lone pigeon
is that a west london slang phrase for swinging or drunk?
December 4th, 2007 at 2:55 pm
357 - Tinsel
I wish i could read the original El Mundo article to clarify this detail. Unlike the Express, the French version of the El Mundo article published in SOS Madeleine is not so conclusive as to WHO actually called WHO. (Frankly I trust El Mundo is a lot more accurate than the Express).
In reality when I read the french translation it says “Gerry initially told police that the call was made 4Km away from PDL”. If it was O’Brian making the call how would Gerry know where he was?
Can anyone find the El Mundo original article?
December 4th, 2007 at 2:55 pm
‘Dr. McCann was supported by a clinical training fellowship from the European Society of Cardiology, Sophia Antipolis, France, and by the East Midlands Heart Research Fund, Leicester, United Kingdom.’
That’s according to the American Journal of Cardiology, 15 February 2007.
Presumably he will not be asking for another grant in the near future…
December 4th, 2007 at 2:54 pm
Matts cyber bar. SteveT got well hammered!
December 4th, 2007 at 2:54 pm
I think the PJ won’t conclude the case until we have. I think we’ll crack it and then hey presto bam! They’re arrested 8.)
December 4th, 2007 at 2:53 pm
lone pigeon
teaser!!!!
which one a hammersmith one?
or matts cyber one?
December 4th, 2007 at 2:50 pm
360 -meaning Murat?
December 4th, 2007 at 2:47 pm
Isn’t it a coincidence that the letter to the Telegraaf was made on June 11?
December 4th, 2007 at 2:46 pm
322 Salomon
The arrogance of this man!
‘He (referring to Bishop) also said that our attitude in this time of adversity was an example for others.
Would you quote this yourself?!!!
Conceited arrogant B*****D.
December 4th, 2007 at 2:45 pm
334 Tinsel
Sagres is west from PDL. If the McCanns were going to Lisbon Airport they should be driving East and then North (about 350 Km).
I think it’s already VERY suspicious the fact that they chose to fly from Lisbon (as opposed to Faro) when going to Casablanca. It’s more or less like going from London to Birmingham through Edinburgh.
Now, where is this barn (is it 25 km East, West or North from PDL o?). And why did Gerry call O’Brien from there? To tell him that he’d got rid of something or to tell him that he’d got something? and Why O’Brien and not anyone else?
Finally, i don’t think you necessarily need two trips. A well-informed local real estate developer could have given you the indications to find an abandoned property on your way to Lisbon - no problem at all.
December 4th, 2007 at 2:44 pm
346 Hideki
The book is interesting. It cost $0.01 plus $3.99 post and packing from Amazon.
The first major case of corpus delecti in the book concerns the case of a woman missing for 19 years. Even with a body, it’s difficult to connect the corpse to the alleged killer. For instance, if the PJ found Madeleine today, there’s still a ton of forensics to do to actually connect how she died to the McCanns or whoever “did it”.
There’s techniques used by the police as a kind of psychological “smoking out” of the perpetrator(s). One is the “Midnight Confession Technique”. Also the way the police release information is carefully designed and not random.
To give you an idea of the degree of sophistication they have these days - a DNA expert in Quantico, Virginia managed to extract DNA from the blood of a pubic lice. He compared it to lice found on a suspect’s body and matched it to a murder/rape victim. They nicknamed this guy “Lord of the Flies”.
The book gives me confidence that the PJ will definitely get “them” in the end.
December 4th, 2007 at 2:44 pm
353
brandon flours Says:
December 4th, 2007 at 2:37 pm
lone pigeon aka gerry mc cant
what about the towel
was that poo pooed yet?
was that bag of clothes ever declared true?
Haven’t heard on both accounts. I’ve been down the pub xx
December 4th, 2007 at 2:43 pm
338
Stevo Says:
December 4th, 2007 at 2:29 pm
334 Tinsel
Good point. So is the barn on the way to Sargres?
***
No one has reported where the barn with the towel and alleged Scenic debris actually was.
Sagres is approximately 28 km from PDL and the infamous call was said to be a similar distance.
It is OBRIAN that made the call. From the Express: “Dr Russell O’Brien has come under investigation after a team of telephone surveillance officers highlighted a mobile phone call made to the missing four-year-old’s father just over a month after she disappeared.”
There are many abandoned barns throughout the region as can be seen through real estate listings. I saw one on Google. They are usually made of stone and are partial ruins surrounded by a lot of scrub grass. Some of the scrub grass actually grows partially in these ruins.
December 4th, 2007 at 2:41 pm
354
just_me
I think he might win something of the year or century!
December 4th, 2007 at 2:41 pm
299 Maria
I only meant stop whinging and accept this place for what it is! If you dont like it, you are free to stay or go of course!
On your other point, Yes, I agree there is - for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction - its a law of nature! They have Governement, establishment and celebrity financial support and they have accused all of us of their own standards of child care. Many of us resent that and naturally want to strike back. As we dont have their resources, we have to post here and in our own little way we let off steam.
Impotence always creates frustration and we are impotent - for example, the man who fell on his sword over the lost disks issue then gets a new £200,000 job in the cabinet office. Nothing we can do except whine and complain here (isnt democracy a wonderful thing? NOT!)
What amazes me is how many ordinary folk continue to support them as if they are royalty - and insult upon insult - Gerry is nominated for Scot of the Year!!!!!
If he gets that kind of support, are we not entitled to deliver some verbal strikes opposing?
December 4th, 2007 at 2:38 pm
341 - Ive emailed the site voicing my disgust that he even be considered for nominations and pointed out that he is in fact irish…will post reply if i get one