What turns ordinary men into extraordinary monsters like Steven Wright, John Halliday Christie, Peter Sutcliffe, Fred West, and others too numerous to mention?
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Steven Wright: Ipswich Killer
(38 posts)-
Posted 5 years ago #
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Anorak posters/threads? Flat beer?
I blame the human condition.Posted 5 years ago # -
"Anorak posters/threads? Flat beer?
I blame the human condition"
..................................................................Ermm!
Posted 5 years ago # -
To be honest, I don't think they are 'turned', I think they are programmed from conception to be what they are and do.
Fate or genes has handed them a wildcard, but its all part of the human condition.
Environment or a neglected childhood may have been a trigger, but some killers come from comfortable backgrounds, and apparently cossetted backgrounds.But I think its a mistake we all make to try to see only the good in humanity, perhaps an arrogance on our part that we can only be 'good'.
Posted 5 years ago # -
JeffreyH.
Quote me No Quotes.
I know exactly things what I have writ.Posted 5 years ago # -
One of the saddest interviews I ever had to do was with a young man who had been introduced to pedophiliac literature as a sick 'joke' by a male nurse whilst coming out of a coma - a process that had lasted some months. He was 14 when he suffered the head injury, 16 when he finally emerged fully from the coma.
Whilst his mind was injured, his body had continued to follow its normal hormonal path, and he was absolutely mortified to admit that his head was full of pedophiliac images. He was accompanied by a 'minder' every time he set foot out of his house to ensure that he did not give in to the urges that flooded his mind - and was happy to so be, for he was the last person who wanted to be the person he had become. His family were devasted by the situation.
Yes, he received very substantial damages, but can any amount of money - or counseling - undo the damage? Not only to him, but to a family who lived in a small rural village in fear that anyone would discover what was going on in their apparently normal bungalow home.
It changed my view of what constitutes 'evil' for ever. The saddest factor for me was knowing that very little help was available to him, and that without his fill time minder, eventually he would be caught ogling small boys somewhere, charged, sentenced, labelled an evil pervert, beaten up in jail, and the family vilified. Yet here he was, pleading with me for help, for a situation not of his making. It haunts me to this day.Posted 5 years ago # -
I blame Noel Edmonds and/or Dick and Dom.
Watching 10 minutes of 'Are you smarter than a 10 year old' the other night was enough to turn me into a potential killer.
***
I started typing this post before Carmen posted hers above; it now seems sadly out of context and a bit flippant. But hey..that's what over-exposure (10 minutes) to Noel Edmonds can do for you.
Posted 5 years ago # -
JeffreyH. (From agw Administrator)
Quote me No Quotes.
I know exactly things what I have writ. [Quote]
..................................................I quote so that other posters know exactly who I am respondng to.
Most forums have this [quote] facility but I see it is not a facility afforded to posters on the Anoraks Forum. Maybe it should be taken on board.Each response on this forum has to be typed into a separate text reply box which in turn elongates the thread. It is much easier to quote someone else's post and reply to it in the same text box. It is more convenient to do this than reply in a blank reply text box. It's not exactly rocket science to operate such a system.
Posted 5 years ago # -
oh do stop whingeing
Posted 5 years ago # -
June! Where are your manners?
It's "please stop whingeing"...
Posted 5 years ago # -
Back on topic: Re the motivation of Serial Killers.
I agree with the police that there should be a National DNA database where every child born, or entering the UK from abroad, should have to have their DNA recorded. If such a system were in operation the depraved necrophiliac killer of Sally Ann Bowman would have been caught within 24 hours instead of it taking 9 months to identify him, and he was only caught because he had his DNA taken for a minor offence involving theft.
I cannot see for the life of me how anyone could object to the DNA database,apart from the wooly minded,namby pamby Liberal do-gooders like Nick Clegg, who are always bleating on about the accused person's human rights. It's about time we considered the human rights of the victims families in these cases.
To, June Johnson:
You are not what I consider to be an ideal moderator if your only response to a suggestion is to imply that the poster is whingeing. In most forum rules there is a claus which refers to "Respect." Maybe you should study this aspect of a moderator's duty and stop insulting people.Posted 5 years ago # -
As an aside Jeffrey; now it has been proven that Dixie(sp?) was the killer of Ms Bowman, should his crime still involve necrophilia?
I thought that was his (rather lame) defence?
Or did he still claim to have had sex with her after he killed her?
Either way; he seems to have got a decent sentence.
Posted 5 years ago # -
Jeffrey
You have been posting here for approx 24hrs, you have rebuked the administrator and you have rebuked me and you have complained about out lack of facilities twice
I suggest you feel your way around this site, and note the quality of the posting, the camaradarie, the lack of rules, and maybe stop throwing your weight around and EARN some respect before you demand it in return for criticising usPosted 5 years ago # -
To, June Johnson
Just to let you know that I have reported your comment re "whingeing" to the appropriate person. I have tried to engage in topical discussion on this forum and being new on here does not give you the right to insult me. Could you please also display the post where I have rebuked a member of admin. I feel that you not only lack respect but you also have a serious attitude problem.
I am surprised that as a so called moderator you seem to be joining the ranks of the forum bullies but you don't intimidate me.
Posted 5 years ago # -
Thats fine Jeffrey.
Which forum bullies are you referring to?Posted 5 years ago # -
Thats fine Jeffrey.
Which forum bullies are you referring to? [Quote]
....................You for a start.
Posted 5 years ago # -
Would you care to clarify 'seem to be joining the ranks of the forum bullies'
and 'me for a start'I have copied and pasted the thread to admin
Posted 5 years ago # -
As an aside Jeffrey; now it has been proven that Dixie(sp?) was the killer of Ms Bowman, should his crime still involve necrophilia?
I thought that was his (rather lame) defence?
Or did he still claim to have had sex with her after he killed her?
Either way; he seems to have got a decent sentence. [Quote]
................................
Yes, I believe that this depraved predator has received an adequate sentence but I do wish that capital punishment was reintroduced for these types of murders.
Why would he have stabbed her at all if he wasn't trying to disable her and have sex with her? I do believe that he did perform necrophilia but maybe unwittingly, not knowing whether or not she was dead or unconscious.Posted 5 years ago # -
To, June Johnson
I hope also that you have copied and pasted to admin the insuting post you sent me regarding "whingeing" when I was only making a suggestion that could improve the format of reply posts. Your response was not in keeping with most forum rules governing respect for other posters. Please remember we all have differing views, that's what forums are all about. If you disagree with any of my posts just say so, I can accept criticism but please don't belittle yourself by insulting me.
Posted 5 years ago # -
Respect For Other Users.
Could we have a ruling such as this on the forum.
All members of this Forum will respect the opinions and presence of other members of the Forum. You are welcome to engage in challenging and spirited debate with other users, but rudeness will not be tolerated. Name-calling, disrespecting other users or throwing personal insults against them will not be tolerated, either from an instigator -OR- from anyone who feels like they should respond to such instigation.
Flaming another user because of their spelling or word choice will not be tolerated, either. Personal attacks of ANY kind are not allowed and users who violate this will have their access removed. If you have an issue with another user, contact a moderator or administrator.
Posted 5 years ago # -
I have to agree you appear to be a smidgeon Captain Mainwaringish in your attitude in here.
This is a robust Forum and I/we expect robust debate. You are doing well. So far you have lectured on the format of the Forum and decided to engage and attack a Moderator.Accusations of bullying are flying about. I have looked very carefully at this evening's thread and it would appear to me the strident and forceful defence of positions is coming from your camp. There was also mention of (Capital) Liberal do gooders. Even Liberals (capital L) have valid expressible viewpoints.
I will not enter into debate with you about this and I will watch the situation carefully. I am, for instance, unhappy about discussion re the specifics of the wants, needs and aspirations of either necrophiliacs or paedophiles.
This is not a new policy for Anorak and it may help you to understand that any attempt to discuss the specifics or reasons of and for such acts or matters is not a suitable subject for the Forum.
By all means discuss the conditions and crimes. Discuss the need for capital punishment or decriminalisation of prostitution, necrophilia, paedophilia, fraud or school yard bullying. Do not go into the specifics because that would lead to a short and unhappy stay for you. There is no temporary Moderation corner in this portion of the site and you are expected to debate not fight.
We all set the pace and standards here. Moderators do take a full part in debate and I welcome constructive ideas but react badly to being lectured, disruption and deliberate confrontation. I do not think you have reached that position but fear you may unless I give a little guidance. You may also find it useful to examine Adding Images / Technical / site rules...Codes of conduct for this Community. Click on Anorak Forums and the link trail should be obvious.
I wish you well and I hope you continue to provide a lively and fruitful contribution.
Bleating sheep attract wolves as well as shepherds and there are wolves with full sets of shark teeth in this sheepfold. Enjoy the debate.One last item:
Despite the sign on as a member (in an effort to appear less confrontational) I am the Administrator here. The buck stops with me. The argument stops with me and if you ask about, politely, you may be told I do not argue in confrontations, I act. That's the unpleasant part of authority; it is not one I shrink from.Posted 5 years ago # -
This sort of thing should be sorted out over a pint.
Jeffrey H I have not got much time right now but a pet topic of mine is criminal psychology, and it would be seriously good (for me)if we could develop the topic. I was an active member of the wonderful Jack the Ripper site "Ripperologist" when it was running. Have you ever encountered it? Also fascinated by the work of John Dougalas - prob dated now and there is certainly the element of car crash rubbernecking but the pshychology is awesome.Capital punishment is a hairy one but needs to be viewed from a detached point of view. Which is very difficult.
I'm running late, but welcome, good to meet you. What's your poison? Talking about pshychology there's a concept called Transferral. An excellent example of this is that I truly believe everyone else drinks to excess too. So far, nothing to change my belief. Which is denial of course. Shit I'm running late... chat later
Penster in Sydney
Posted 5 years ago # -
'morning boys and girls!
Have we all been having a bit of a tiff?
Where are we having this pint then Penster? Your place or over here?
I have no desire to get involved in the finer points of who said what to whom; I have more important matters to attend to (the cat has just sat on the desk and dipped his tail in my coffee...). Suffice to say that I like the format of this forum, the attitudes of the members, and I welcome new members and the opportunity to hear their viewpoint. I may not agree with said viewpoint, but what the hell...that's life!
I would however fight to keep my right to act as a 'grammar nazi', or to hurl good natured insults about - where humour can be extracted from the situation. I also expect and enjoy similar stuff heading in my direction. I'd hate to see this place lose its identity, and be bound by jobsworthy rules and regs with everyone pussyfooting around issues, for fear of upsetting anyone.
Bye for now; got to go. (the horse trailer needs a new floor and the dealer is waiting for the arrival of my trailer, and my open wallet!)
Posted 5 years ago # -
Get the horse a cart. Keep her-indoors in the scullery with the daughter making clothes pegs. Buy a sleeveless leather jerkin and a cloth cap and get out totting.
Make a few bob.That's the answer; solve the nation's goldfish crisis and get back to traditional conservative (small c) values at the same time. The trailer could be used to carry the filthy lucre to the local branch of William & Glynns Bank.
Posted 5 years ago # -
From agw..Admin
By all means discuss the conditions and crimes. Discuss the need for capital punishment or decriminalisation of prostitution, necrophilia, paedophilia, fraud or school yard bullying. Do not go into the specifics because that would lead to a short and unhappy stay for you. There is no temporary Moderation corner in this portion of the site and you are expected to debate not fight. [Quote]
....................................................................................How on earth does one discuss a subject without going into the specifics of the subject
being discussed? I thought that we were allowed free speech on a forum, unless that free speach involves, racism, libel, lack of respect for other posters and hurtful and insulting comments, etc.If you are telling me that I am not permitted to discuss a criminal case in detail, or mention the specifics of a case once the accused person concerned has been found guilty then I would arrive at the obvious conclusion that I was being denied the right to engage in any in depth discussion of such a subject. If that were the case I would not hang around waiting to be banned from the forum, I would automatically leave.
Posted 5 years ago # -
To, Penster..Sydney.
(Regarding insight into the serial killer's mind)
In answer to you recent post to me.
Where does this urge come from, and why is so powerful? If we all experienced this urge, would we be able to resist? Is it genetic, hormonal, biological, or cultural conditioning? Do serial killers have any control over their desires?
We all experience rage and inappropriate sexual instincts, yet we have some sort of internal "cage" that keeps our inner monsters locked up. Call it morality or social programming, these internal blockades have long since been trampled down in the psychopathic killer. Not only have they let loose the monster within, they are virtual slaves to its beastly appetites. What sets them apart?
They are in the main sociopaths who have no internal cage to keep their actions under control whereas the normal man or woman has. I believe it is more a matter of genetically crossed wiring in the serial killer's makeup rather than lack of programming.
Posted 5 years ago # -
Once again you lecture.
You appear to wish to deliberately misunderstand. That is, of course, your right.
I assure you I am the wrong individual with whom to argue semantics or philosophy.For the very last time, do not quote vast chunks of my posting back to me. All here can follow a thread.
You are allowed free speech on this Forum and if you suggest, as you quite blatantly are, I would deny you free speech, make no mistake, as a professional journalist I would regard that as criminal libel and would pursue you.
That is not likely to occur. I was very specific when I said I shall not argue with you and would act. I will if this vein continues.Leave if you do not enjoy our company. Yours has disturbed me in the past and I was prepared to tolerate it again for a short while. It looks unlikely to be a burden for very much longer.
I shall make this crystal clear; if I, as the very next step, block you and mark you as a bozo, your recourse is to write to:
I will say just one thing on this thread.
You ask why ordinary men are turned into the animal which was Steven Wright?
Where is the evidence he was ever anything other than extraordinarily evil?
Clearly a very strong person; during interviews with police he remained silent throughout That is extremely difficult to do.Time and further investigation will reveal more.
Posted 5 years ago # -
Mic, a bottle of plonk on my deck whenever yr all ready! And I'll wheel out the good stuff. What is it with cats dipping their tails in drink? Rainbow's tail has darkened. If the booze runs out I can just suck on her tail. Good thing I gave up Midori. Still coming over for that drink?!
JeffreyH, I dont know why, but quoting text back gives me the shits something severe! I also hate it when used in the verbal as a debating style. It assumes that other readers can't or won't read. FFS don't get yrself barred, it's a pretty good spot here, some really good minds floating around and funny too. A bit of tension is no bad thing either.
The cage metaphor is disturbing - the assumption here is pretty horrible. I agree with you and June regarding "hardwiring", the premise being that it's like any other genetic condition. Genetic, hormonal, biological, or cultural conditioning? Yep, all of the above. Premeditated crimes where the perpetrator plans and goes to great length not to be caught - exhibits choice and control. Bad stuff.
Posted 5 years ago # -
JefferyH
I'm coming in at the end of this, but everything seems to have gone "Tits up" recently, regarding your posts to June, one of Anorak's moderators.
If you were a regular reader of forums, you would appreciate "Anorak's" style of humour.
June's "Oh, do stop whingeing", in my experience, was intended solely as a good natured comment.
Jeffery, keep on posting, I like your take on things.
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.That sounds contradictorial, doesn't it?
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.PISSED AGAIN!
Posted 5 years ago # -
G'day Bill. how's it going? Long time no posts...other than to comlain about being labelled a 'bleeder'. I'd have thought you'd be more aggrieved at being labelled as my brother!
JeffreyH seems to have gone quiet. It's a shame; other opinions and 'new blodd' are what's needed to liven things up.
Although one of AGW's comments seemed to allude (posh word for a sunday morning...) to the fact that JeffreyH had been around before under another name, and had hacked agw off then. Or maybe I'm reading too much into it. I'd cut and paste the relevant line, but would probably get my arse kicked from here to Oswaldtwistle and back.
-agw
Not a problem:
"Yours' (company) has disturbed me in the past and I was prepared to tolerate it again for a short while."It refers to that Other Place. I believe in new beginnings.
Posted 5 years ago #
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