I support ‘The Sun’. From the start, it was the news of the world/sun who got involved in this case, putting up posters of missing Madeline, making it public knowledge, whilst the police plodded along, plus their involvement led to the huge reward for Madeline’s safe return. True, all of this could help to boost sales of the newspapers, BUT if it contributed to Madeline being found safe and well, then it would have been a worthwhile effort. It would have accomplished the mission.

If the media hadn’t of got involved, then Madeline’s case would have been put in the police administrative bin of life just like the others who have gone missing in Portugal.

I personally have a axe to grind against any police because I was stalked by them because I have a druggie ex-brother-in-law, and they thought I was involved. At any time they could’ve searched my house/asked questions, but no, this wasn’t good enough. I heard that Murat wasn’t happy about being under surveillance for a week after Madeline was abducted..Poor soul–I’ve had 4 years of police stalking only because I’m associated to a no-good druggie. Even if Murat is ‘under seige’ he’s under seige for good reason. I don’t have child porn/beastility on my computer or anything to hide from the police. I reckon his mother is involved too in providing him with an alibi. Everything will come out in the wash and I’ll sent the old bat a letter if she has protected her dear son. My ex-brother-in-law’s mother thought the sun shone out of her no-good druggie son and failed to put him into check. One man’s sin affects many others.

As for Murat, he put himself in the media arena from the start, joking that he was the ‘prime suspect’. So many people couldn’t have all been wrong. On the first Saturday Madeline was missing, Murat was working with a Porteuguese public official, and on the Sunday morning, the official went to the police and made a full statement about Murat and a ‘character defect’. Then the journalist and the car hire lady with their doubts about Murat. Murat claims to be innocent, but the evidence is contradictory.

Quite

Hear Hear

Please this is ridiculous…..the Mccann’s are guilty on ONE thing and ONE thing only….. leaving their children unattended. They will pay for that mistake for the rest of their lives, no matter what the outcome of this tragic case it. BUT to accuse them of being part of the disaperance of their beloved daughter is SHOCKING and who ever came up with that is SERIOUSLY SICK and need help!!!! It is clear for any normal person to see that the Mccann’s are loving parents - just look at the photos of Madeleine….they say it all!!!!! These poor guilt ridden people work continously for ONE purpose, and - and that is to be reunited with their beautiful daughter!!!! Would you rather they just forgot about her and went back home???? Would that be nromal??? NO it would NOT!!! So give them a break. If nothing else - PLEASE send positive thought for Madeleine, who is the totally innocent victim - and lets all hope she can soon be found safe and returned to her family where she belongs!!!!

Jane - you are right. Over in Germany, the German TV host questioned the McCanns’ involvement. The McCanns do not control the media. They cannot. The fear is that the media controls them and they will end up labelled as The Parents of the Missing Girl……

I have wondered all along if the Media was building the McCanns up only to drop them in the mire.
Somehow I don’t think they had anything to do with their daughter’s disappearence other than leave her unattended, but family do get considered as suspects, and making a lot of noise could be seen by some as ‘guilt’ but I really feel their guilt is ‘just’ leaving the children alone.

Not knowing Mr Murat at all, and he isn’t on bail or arrested, so perhaps wait until a development occurs and there is something to charge people with other than supposition.

It is still possible that Madeleine woke and wandered off.

June

I’d like to thank anorak for some of the most common sense reporting on this story, amid much awful reporting. Thx to dogstar and DL too for recalling the presumption of innocence. Robert M’s guilt or innocence is indeed really not the point at the moment. He IS innocent until proven guilty, and as an ‘innocent’ person has had his life, and more peripherally the lives of his family members, utterly torn apart. Reading the multiple reports on the web and their many many inaccuracies - beginning even with his nationality - he has been stained by so many allegations (vault in the basement, child pornographer, etc) without any proof whatsoever, at least none presented by the police or any newspaper I would trust. His own daughter and ex wife had to leave their home and seek refuge in a safe-house … What kind of taunts will his daughter face when she goes to school? How will this make her feel about her father? Is he ever going to find a job again? His past employment was in selling holiday homes to British people. Is anyone going to employ him to do that every again? Would anyone buy a house from him? What other career is he going to pursue? I suspect that people, myself included, do not begin to imagine how this has changed his life forever. Perhaps the most ironic is that, if one accepts his claims as true, he went very significantly out of his way to provide help to the McCann family and the Portuguese police because he wanted desperately to help Madeleine be recovered safely and quickly. Whether he offered help in an inappropriate way etc is neither here nor there. That someone’s life could be torn apart because of his compassion must be an extraordinarily bitter bakground to this whole situation. And, above all, I cannot see remotely how destroy Robert Murat’s life has in any way helped Madeleine? Even if he is guilty, has the trial by lies and innuendo made any positive difference to her situation? I hope that some of the journalists responsible are considering what they have done in the interests of headlines and selling newspapers. Will the newspapers that have been so quick to target Robert Murat offer him just one front page article to absolve to rehabilitate him if he is cleared of any suspicion by the police? The McCann’s have not faced anything like the accusations targetd at Robert Murat but i think too that their reputations should not be dragged through the media on the basis of vague innuendo.

Something is puzzling me about this DNA sample of Murat’s. I read an interview with him the other day (sorry, can’t remember where) where he said that the police never took a DNA sample from him when he was first taken in for questioning and in general saying what a shambles the whole thing had been. Within a day the police were hurriedly asking for a “new” one because the “first’ one had been lost. Not a peep now about how there was, apparently no “first” one in any case. I think the police have made grave errors here and the McCanns have realised/been advised that the only way of getting them to bother with the case is to keep the media on it with the associated threat to the tourist bucks. I think I would do the same and let people think what they want. The Portuguese force has the control of the case which ties the hands of a variety of other agencies who might have more nous in the matter, without all this fuss, media, Gordon Brown, Pope et al to put the pressure on them they would clearly to my mind have done even less. It looks as if everyone, the McCanns, Murat, the British Ambassador even the wretched media is treading on eggshells not to piss of the cops but in some way to keep necessary pressure on the and to get some information out of them about what is being done. The McCanns are entitled to want that information even if we are not. I should think the people of Portugal and the tourists who will (or won’t) visit the Algarve are pretty entitled too. Borders weren’t sealed, helicopters did not go up to intercept boats leaving that coast in time. Enough was not done and it could have been and should have been for Madeleine and any other lost child therefore it’s reasonable to assume that if the McCanns shut up and went home the cops would not continue to do their best.
As for suggesting that anything they are doing lays them open to ludicrous suggestions of involvement. “The more the family continue to put theimselves in the spotlight, the more akward and uncomfortable the questions will become.” How? Why? I don’t follow at all, the logic is crap. The perception of “the spotlight”, when it focuses on one for any reason other than enormous talent, as such a wonderful privilege that even people who have lost their tiny daughter are to be resented and chided for having it is the province of people with attention-seeking neuroses to rival Charley Uchea. It’s not a privilege it’s a curse and the McCanns are clearly enduring it because they think it is the only way to prevent Madeleine’s possible plight from being forgotten which would crash her already slim chances of rescue right through the floor. Regardless of the criticism of the mistake they made that night they plainly care more about their daughter than they do about the neurotic opinions (alleged boredom) of armchair ranters. Evidence is the only thing that proves someone guilty and so far there is precious little of any sort.

I agree about the ‘trial by media hysteria’ that has befallen people in the past, such as Colin Stagg, or the poor chap who was initially all over the papers for the Ipswich prostitute killings.
However, in this case I feel its different as it isn’t just ‘vague innuendo’. Murat has been caught with child porn and has a “relevant sexual history” i.e. he has a sexual interest in kids.
Furthermore the press coverage about his child porn wasn’t vague or implied or innuendo, it was a very specific and very clear and it was in many papers here and in Portugal. The Mail, The Express, The Sun, Sky News et al all specifically claim he has child porn on his PC.
It would be easy enough for Murat to refute all this via the press complaints commission, or through legal channels, but I don’t hear him denying it, and none of his friends or family are either ? Murat would be in line for millions if any of this were unsubstantiated would he not ? He could take them all to the cleaners.
The fact is Murat IS a paedophile, and him watching children being abused on the internet means he deserves all he gets in my book.
As for the rubbish from Dogstar (above) about operation ore , it wasn’t just on the basis of credit card statements alone, the guilty all had child porn on their hard drives. They had their PC’s taken away and forensically examined. They were only charged if images were actually found on the hard drive - the credit card statements weren’t enough on their own, and weren’t used in isolation, but were one part of a body of evidence used in court.

Goog post ‘Otherwize’.

I’ve seen a few of your posts, all points very well made.

It amazes me that people come on here and congratulate Anorak on being the voice of reason. I actually find Anoraks views as particularly cynical, inflammatory and to be honest, stirring up hate for the McCanns. There has been very little support from Anorak for the plight of Madeleine and the suffering of her parents.

If Murat is innocent, his name will be cleared. If he is guilty, it won’t. I am sure with the inevitable help of Max Clifford he will be able to turn it to his advantage.

And further to what I just wrote above. Even IF Murat turned out to have been looking at nasty porn and was a paedophile it still wouldn’t necessarily make him the paedophile who took Madeleine.
The wiped hard drive gives pause for thought but it’s about a million times more likely that he was worrying about the taxman for instance. People have loads of things to hide from the police other than a taste for little kids. I’m not especially defending him here, but no way do we know anything that incriminates him so far.
I know a lot of the chaps on this site are dubious about the number of paedophiles out there but to be honest, judging by the sheer number of women I have known who have been abused , I tend to think that there are an awful lot of them out there but not necessarily all of them active abusers. And not all of them psychotics with the potential to abduct and/or kill. I do therefore respect the point Anorak’s making about the pressure being put on someone who might be holding her and be made even more desperate, dissociated, and just plain fucked up and freaked out and might therefore feel they have no alternative but to murder. But the thing that concentrates my mind again and again is the growing incidences of children that ARE found, sometimes after many years. It’s hard to contemplate but the evidence seems to suggest that not all paedophiles are either psychotic or sadistic in motivation (whatever the effect) and cases like Sean Hornberg’s have really altered the landscape of child abduction. it’s a terrible scenario to consider, especially if you are Ben Needham’s mum, but it at least has the virtue of a little hope.

I’m not saying Murat is involved in Madeleines case, like anyone else outside the investigation I couldn’t possibly know, although I have my own suspicions.
My position is that the press focus on Murat is understandable due to his bizzare behaviour since Madeleines abduction, and him being named a formal suspect by the Police.
I also feel that the child porn claims in the press about Murat are quite specific, and appear to have been leaked by somebody close to the investigation, which gives them more credability.
It would be simple enough for Murat, or a lawyer or family friend, to issue even a denial about the porn allegation. In the interim his legal team could also go for an injunction. He, like everyone else, does have quite a lot of rights in law to protect himself from the UK press - he can sue for libel, a printed apology and damages for example. The fact Murat won’t deny the lurid headlines is interesting in my opinion.
Whatever you think about the UK red tops the editors and publishers aren’t stupid enough to make such serious front page allegations without being able to back it up.
Here’s a typical article about Murat

http://www.thesun.co.uk/article/0,,2005320001-2007240420,00.html

I see your point Pete. However, the editors and publishers of tabloids and red tops are stupid enough to publish allegations without any real proof. How many times do papers have to apologise or pay damages to people, Joe Bloggs or celebs, after having printed a story that proves to be wholly unsubstantiated? Elton John, Keira Knightley are just a couple of recent examples - Piers Morgan was sacked as Editor of the Daily Mirror over the publishing of faked ‘photos. Don’t get me wrong, this issue is far more important than a ‘celeb’ who sues because somone suggests they may turn teenage girls into anorexics - but it does happen.

Pete wrote: ‘…As for the rubbish from Dogstar (above) about operation ore , it wasn’t just on the basis of credit card statements alone, the guilty all had child porn on their hard drives. They had their PC’s taken away and forensically examined. They were only charged if images were actually found on the hard drive - the credit card statements weren’t enough on their own, and weren’t used in isolation, but were one part of a body of evidence used in court…’

The class action against the UK police specifically addresses the issue of just how those PCs were ‘forensically examined’ - and, with the use of the entire original database from landslide upon which the whole investigation was based (and which has since been obtained by the defence teams) it can be demonstrated the forensic methods employed at the time to convict the accused were deeply flawed, if not wilfully negligent.

Pete, you are just another example of the way the public unflinchingly accepts that just because some policeman gets himself on TV and tells you This Is How It Is (and Jim Gamble specialises in emotive, headline-grabbing utterances) his words are accepted as fact.

Operation Ore is in deep trouble. See here:

http://www.pcpro.co.uk/features/74690/operation-ore-exposed.html

…and here:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/crime/article/0,,2059880,00.html

and please stop making a fool of yourself in public.

I am absolutely convinced that she will be found safe and sound soon. Just because the PJ have gone silent, means they are doing their job well. Any leaks will cause the perps to go underground. They have the best of help with technology now.They will track them down , and either arrest them, or the perps will drop off the little girl.
I am just sick over the anguish the parents must be going through. I have a little 4 year old boy , and can’t stand to be away from him for a few hours, let alone a month, especially not knowing where he might be.
Personally I feel it was a kidnapping , not for money, but for a baby. Common sense will prevail , and the guilty will come forward.
Best of luck to all involved. I hope she returns very soon indeed.